OK, I'm getting this now in your situation . . .

for many of us the 504 Plan is developed (and literally "written" or entered into computer format) REAL TIME in the meeting . . . every player agrees to accommodation and wording before we move on to next item . . . so no notes really need to be taken.  At end of meeting, the plan is printed up, we all read over and sign . . . or agree to continue the meeting at later, mutually agreed upon date (soon) to continue and complete.

In your instance, those meeting notes are absolutely material.

Wow.

Quote from: ajasfolks2 on September 08, 2014, 08:30:06 AM
You know, this thread got me to Googling this morning.

Looks like the school district can make "Meeting Minutes"  part of its 504 Policies and Procedures.  See here under "504 meeting":

http://www.fmschools.org/learning-teaching.cfm?subpage=15337


And here is Charlotte Mecklenburg Co in NC -- multiple references to Meeting Notes and encourages that as means of documentation.  Guess they want accountability, huh?   

http://www.cms.k12.nc.us/cmsdepartments/ci/supportservices/section504/Documents/2013%20Revised%20Section%20504%20CMS%20Handbook.pdf

I don't see how they can make a plan without notes of some kind.  I'm not as familiar with 504 meetings as the rest of you, but in our case, we had the meeting, and they sent us the written plan 3 weeks later.  How would they know what to put in the plan if they didn't take notes? Still waiting to hear back from OCR.  I've been a little snotty with the investigator, so she may be ignoring me. 

You know, this thread got me to Googling this morning.

Looks like the school district can make "Meeting Minutes"  part of its 504 Policies and Procedures.  See here under "504 meeting":

http://www.fmschools.org/learning-teaching.cfm?subpage=15337


And here is Charlotte Mecklenburg Co in NC -- multiple references to Meeting Notes and encourages that as means of documentation.  Guess they want accountability, huh?   

http://www.cms.k12.nc.us/cmsdepartments/ci/supportservices/section504/Documents/2013%20Revised%20Section%20504%20CMS%20Handbook.pdf

Only notes (scribbling on paper) I've ever seen taken are "notes to self" by a staffer if he/she has been tasked to do something or verify safety of something:  for example, I've seen a teacher or staff write note to self to check latex content of specific classroom supplies.

I've never seen schools keep official notes (aka "meeting minutes"?) for our 504s . . . if we have digital recorder, they have used cassette tape recorders . . . but no notes, officially or otherwise. 

I don't even know what to suggest at this point. I don't know that going to your OCR again will have a different outcome.

Quote from: CMdeux on September 05, 2014, 12:08:25 PM
REQUIRED?  not unless their own procedural guidelines say so, no.

At least that is my understanding.  On the other hand, you know that such notes DO exist, and in that case, then yeah-- they are "records" if decisions are being made using those notes.

Unfortunately, they still don't have any 504 Policies.  Well, they have them, and they are implemented, but since the board has not yet voted on them, parents are not permitted to know what they are.  Even though the policies were written up and implemented since last March.  And even though the district weaseled their way out of an OCR investigation.  I really wish I was kidding. 

REQUIRED?  not unless their own procedural guidelines say so, no.

At least that is my understanding.  On the other hand, you know that such notes DO exist, and in that case, then yeah-- they are "records" if decisions are being made using those notes.

I may or may not have just received a letter from the Superintendent stating that the meeting notes taken by staff members are personal notes, not shareable with anyone, and exempt from parental access under FERPA.  I sent an email to OCR asking if these notes were shared with them.  She told me she requested them.  I don't know if she'll be permitted to share whether she received them. 

Aren't school required to keep notes during the meeting for the 504 file?

Hypothetically, if it were I, I'd wait to see if I finally get the "meeting notes" . . . or if yet another excuse and no notes.

Based on own personal experiences:

I wouldn't be surprised to get a response from school that the "meeting notes" are not "relevant records" and therefore would not be made available . . .

I wouldn't be surprised to receive a response that I needed to come in and pay for the copies of the notes . . . at some $ amt per page . . . likely in form of a money order as they won't take personal check or cash. 

I wouldn't be surprised to receive NO notes and NO response by close of business at end of week . . . and then when I ask again for notes, they claim they never received this request . . .


~ ~ ~

I do not know what OCR exactly considers to be "relevant records" but common sense would tell me that OCR should be considering any and ALL 504 meeting notes as DIRECTLY RELEVANT -- whether the meeting included the parents or not.

~ ~ ~

If the district's procedural safeguards   seem vague and easily interpreted / re-interpreted to suit the needs of the school district and/or to NOT favor the parents / child, then that may in itself be worth pursuing with OCR?  Maybe.


I'd be hanging in there.   

Hypothetically speaking, of course,  if your school wrote up a 504 over the summer, and was borderline bullying you into signing it over the summer,   and your school's procedural safeguards stated "you have a right to request and receive copies of relevant records" regarding your child's 504, and you requested copies of the meeting notes (which you know the school has already willingly provided to OCR but the school doesn't know that you know this) and the superintendent responded in writing saying that since the school is closed for summer, you can't get the meeting notes, would that be a violation?  The secretarial staff and administration was in for the summer, so I find his excuse to be fishy.  Plus, being that I was asked (threatened) to consider the plan and respond over the summer, they shouldn't be able to ignore their own procedural safeguards because it is the summer.    Does OCR see meeting notes as "relevant records?"

And school has been back in session for 3 days.  I may have sent a friendly reminder asking for the meeting notes by the end of the week.